Improving Organization Performance with | Alisa Angelo & Joyce Odidison

Unlock high performance without burnout! In this episode of the Resilience Catalyst Show, Joyce Odidison speaks with Alisa Angelo, CEO of Compass Business Solutions, about how leaders can achieve better results and build high-performing teams while avoiding burnout. Discover the importance of resilience in leadership and how to create a culture of trust and accountability. 

Key takeaways: 

00:00 Introduction 

00:29 The challenge of high performance and burnout 

01:18 Building resilient teams 

02:01 Alisa's journey from elite gymnast to CEO 

04:54 The importance of self-management for leaders 

06:15 The impact of leadership on team performance 

10:31 The role of trust in leadership 

12:19 Creating a culture of accountability 

18:06 The importance of self-care for leaders 

20:26 Strategies for reducing stress and burnout 

What's your biggest challenge with building resilient teams? Drop it in the comments! 

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Connect with Alisa: 

Website: https://www.wearecompass.com 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/compass-business-solutions-inc 

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Compassbusinesssolutions 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/weare_compass/ 

About IWS: 

The Currency of Resilience: 

◼️Be the first to hear about Joyce’s new book - https://www.joyceodidison.com/cracking-the-code-on-your-resilience 

◼️Book Joyce’s Compelling Keynote: https://www.joyceodidison.com/ 

◼️Get coached by Joyce: https://www.joyceodidison.com/coaching 

◼️Get email updates: https://interpersonalwellness.com/newsletter/ 

◼️Follow Joyce: https://www.joyceodidison.com/links 

◼️Purchase Joyce’s books here: https://www.joyceodidison.com/books 

#Leadership #Resilience #Burnout 

Transcript

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SPEAKER_01 0:00

If you're feeling drained, exhausted, overwhelmed, or worked out, this show is for you. And I want you to know that you're not alone. Millions of professionals are operating in a resilience deficit. On the resilience catalyst show, you learn how to understand, rebuild, and grow the currency of resilience so you can restore your energy, think clearly under pressure, navigate conflict with confidence, and sustain your performance without burning out. I'm Joyce of Edison, your host, friend, and resilience catalyst. Let's get started. Alisa is CEO and owner of Compass Business Solutions. Alisa is a trusted partner in business. Leaders who want to realize their company's true potential call her up. She provides deep expertise in operations, corporate training, and executive coaching because she comes from a background of an athlete, and she's gonna give us some insights on how she made that transition, her business, her work, her passion. And I can't wait for you to meet her. Alisa, welcome to the Resilience Catalyst Show.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Thank you, Joyce. Thank you for having me. I'm excited for our conversation today.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Absolutely. So before we get you into your work with organizations and so forth, I would love for you to tell us what did that experience that teach you, the experience of being an athlete, the performance, the discipline, the resilience, the pressure. How does that relate to where you are right now? And then you can give us a little bit uh into the journey.

SPEAKER_00 1:52

Sure. Those skill sets completely grounded me and created who I am today. Um, first of all, I was an elite gymnast. That's a ranking to say elite, and I trained for the Olympics. I did not make the Olympics, but I was the number one uh recruited gymnast my senior year in high school. So I was able to go to college on a full ride. I chose the University of Pittsburgh, but I had a very non-traditional way of growing up. I got out of school after I took my honors classes at around 11:30, and my parents, my mother, would drive me to the gym a half an hour away, and I'd spend four to six hours training. And my parents were both in education, so there was no sliding on my uh academics. And I had a beautiful grandmother who lived with me, and she was always pushing us. And I remember once getting a 99 on a test, and she said in her Latvian accent, and do I not a hundred, right? So this is the environment that I grew up in, both in my home and in the gym. And so when you come home at night and you have to then start studying and learn great self-management skills, how do you optimize your performance holistically, right? And we work with people in organizations where it's not just about work, it's you as the whole, because work and life flow into each other and those skill sets of self-management, everything from what you put in your body to how you sleep to um how you organize your day makes you strong and resilient and able to perform your best. And those are a lot of those skills that I learned growing up in the gym.

SPEAKER_01 3:38

I love that you're showing these skill sets because they are so important in everything we do. One of our challenges today in our society, and um I was just telling you about my my new book coming out. It's uh it's hacking the code in your resilience, and we're looking at uh how the connection, the common cause between uh burnout and mental health and leadership breakdown, that in this information age we're in, there is a common cause, and we're looking at the resilience depletion. And there is there are thoughts that says working and being diligent, working hard will help us to build our resilience. And there is this thought right now that we have to protect our children from hard work. Uh, you shouldn't do too much. What is the cost? What are we what are we losing? You know, as you share the story of your grandmother asking you, where the rest of the night. You know, I was so shocked when we went into a session and our son was playing soccer, and they were like, Oh, we're not putting scores up anymore. Uh it's just everybody participate. What do we say? What message are we sending to that next generation of the workforce as we as we start doing that?

SPEAKER_00 4:59

Yes, it's it's not what I would consider healthy and it doesn't build resilience as we know. Um, and I agree with you. And there's been many times as a parent as well, where my children, I remember one situation where um one of my children said, Hey, I gotta enroll in SATs for my SATs and asked me to do it. And I said, if you can go to college, you can go on the platform and enroll. Here's the credit card, whatever you need. And she said, but everybody else's mom or everybody else's dad does it for them. And that's where I said, you know, and again, going back to some of those things you learn in the home, one of the wonderful things that my mom taught me was the greatest gift you can give your children is independence, right? To make them strong and to be able to function because, and as my father would say, no one goes through this world unscathed. And so there is going to be crisis and trauma and setbacks. And it's not that they're not gonna happen, and you can't control those, but you can control through your mindset and your workability how to get through those things. So a lot of it, I believe, is how you think, right? And going back to my athletics background, it was very clear to me, and as I've worked with uh athletes at all stages as well in collegiate programs and professional athletes, is that there are so many talented people out there, but the differentiation between optimal performance and being talented is that mind and hard work combination that the people excel have, right? So for sure, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

Yes, and and you know, we see that same thing showing up in the workplace now. We're seeing where um people are showing up at work and work is too hard.

SPEAKER_00 6:57

Why should I work 40 hours? That's too much.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

I know, and things have changed in our workplace, but there are other elements to it that we have to recognize we are definitely in a different era. Definitely a different era, and our our employees are seen, and leadership is different in this time. So, what are you seeing with leaders? And how are you helping leaders with that curve in that new mentality? Because many of our leaders grew up in a time where work was supposed to be, that's why it's called work. It's hard. You have to touch yourself, turn it out. For sure. But we're seeing coming from that athlete world where you you have to be doing it, you have to practice, you have to memorize, you have to, you have to get your muscles ready. You can't just wake up and go compete, right? Right. What are you making just even making it to be eligible for the Olympics takes extraordinary effort, which we seems seems like a thing of the past these days.

SPEAKER_00 8:08

And I wouldn't completely generalize that, right? Because I see people in all generations who are are, as we would say, rock stars, or you know, of course, have superior performance. Uh, but I do think there is a downward trend, and I agree with you wholeheartedly on that. And so one of the things that we work with with leaders is first to understand themselves and have the self-awareness of where they're coming from, where their strengths and challenge areas are, how to get them to perform optimally so they can be the best leader for organizations. And so that's a really great starting point, is that self-awareness? How do they maybe present differently? So many times you hear from leaders, well, this is how I would respond to that situation. And that's I'd say, well, that's why you're in a leadership role, and maybe not in this entry-level individual contributor role. And so it really is getting some perspective and understanding where the challenges of our new workforce is and how we can take what we've learned and be able to translate and transform what we're seeing. Because you're right, there is a huge deficit. We've heard from CEOs that they're implementing AI because they can't find the talent and the resiliency and the skill sets they need from the humans. And that's that's petrifying, right? So we do need to tool our every level in the organization on how to be strong, resilient, work hard. Um, we talk a lot, even at Compass, we try to normalize failure. I don't want my team failing on the same thing over and over again. That's what I'm not asking for. But our performance recap is a celebration of what they tried and did differently and excelled in. And then I want to know, where did you fail? Because if you're not failing, that means that you're not trying hard enough. You're not pushing yourself. Because if you've been in environments where, no, no, we're gonna protect you, we don't want you to fail. No one has to know that they came last on the team. And so, like you said, everybody gets the award. We're not putting up scores. We're trying to take people away from that environment, bringing them into where you will not have a competitive advantage if you don't compete and excel in the workplace. Um, how do we get them to shift their mindset? How do we make it okay to compete and win and want to be part of a winning team? It feels good to be part of a winning team. How do we start changing cultures to be able to make that happen?

SPEAKER_01 10:39

This is such a good conversation because there needs to be a level of accountability at the leadership level in order for this to flow down and become a culture of trust. And this is something that's really challenged, I find, in organizations. And as a as a team player, as a sports person coming from that background, being part of a team requires ultimate trust. I often look at the the the gymnast and when they have to do all these different activities, especially when they're when they're partnered up. And I'm like, you have to have the ultimate trust in that person, right? When you're doing uh, for instance, they're doing this the skating when they're doing the different pieces where they have to put trust in their partners. And we would we would benefit so much from that level of trust in the workplace. We don't see that a lot, but I often say to leaders, it comes from the culture you build, the culture of trust. Absolutely. Because as a conflict analyst, I go into the organization when there is a lot of conflict, when things are falling apart, people are no longer communicating. I can't get the report from Jim because um he doesn't respond to my email, or I can't, you know, why we fail on this project because the communication was poor. And so failure, like you said, is very much a part of learning and growth. But if if it's things that can be avoided, if it's due to conflict, if it's due to low trust, if it's due to communication breakdown, those are fixable things. And I think another challenge we see often is in that culture shift where we're looking at are people just so tired that they cannot think anymore to have healthy relationships in the workplace? What kind of sport metaphor could we use to help them shift the lens?

SPEAKER_00 12:44

Well, when we do, we do a lot of work taking very um uncohesive teams, executive teams, leadership teams, and making them cohesive. And you're right, the first thing we work on is trust. After we've done the self-awareness and they've taken assessments to understand who they are, how they come across, how to be other-centered rather than self-centered? It is about trust. And in all relationships, whether it's we're talking about trust with your partner and the people that you love and your family and your friends, those are the same skills and the same um principles that apply to being a trusted leader and a trusted leadership team. So is your team able to be vulnerable and say, I made a mistake? Do they know where they are on the accountability ladder to say, I was not accountable, I missed a deadline. That's unacceptable. You know, we talk about this all the time. You know, we we as leaders are inefficiable, right? And we're swimming around, and our teams, you can you can put out the most beautiful communications and have this great communications and marketing department. But if you're not living what you're preaching about trust and how we deal with conflict in the workplace, um then they know, you know, you're they're observing us every single day by our actions. We know this during the pandemic, right? You talk about culture transformation. At Compass, we define culture as the acceptable behaviors in an organization. So conversely, it's also the unacceptable behaviors, right? And people posted core values and they're employing manuals and they're on the conference room walls, and that all sounded really great until the pandemic hit. And then corporations were making leadership teams, because that's what a corporation is. It's just a group of humans, right, with some paperwork. It were making decisions not based on those values which define the culture. And we know how disengaged our workplace became when a lot of the leaders did not make decisions based on what we said is our culture. So all these pieces start tying together. But what we also know from the research is that if you don't have a relationship with trust, then it is very difficult to be able to resolve conflict effectively, right? And so that's why we always start with that baseline of the skill sets to build trust. Um, and we use different models. We with one group we might talk about Pat Lancioni's triangle and all the pieces that create trust. We might use Brene Brown's braving model, all these great theories all lend and have the same common things that we need to be able to do to get people to want to follow us, whether it is as a parent in the home or being a good solid friend or as a leader in the workplace.

SPEAKER_01 15:39

That is so important, you know, using different tools to build trust and to help people to find themselves. One of the things we do at Interpersonal Wellness Services is use the WISP platform to help that whole nine-dimensional framework. Because what we're finding is that if you don't trust yourself, you're not able to trust others and become trustworthy, a trustworthy leader that people want to follow. And I talk a lot about that in the in the upcoming book, on building those anchors as a leader and helping your employees to recognize and build those resilience anchors, because this is the currency for life in our very, very stretched world where people are so tired and we see so much burnout happening. When you work with leaders who are depleted and mean that they're overstretched, they're overwhelmed, probably suffering from different kinds of fatigue syndrome. And yes, mental health is an issue in our society today. What is the impact you're noticing on their team when we have that depleted leader?

SPEAKER_00 16:50

Right. Well, again, we're in that fishbowl and we take uh our cues from that. And so if they're working nonstop and irritable, then we're supposed to work nonstop, and then it's acceptable behavior to be irritable. So a compass, we're always trying to reinforce look at yourself in the mirror first. And a lot of the burnout and the exhaustion isn't just work-related, right? Like things happen in our home. We're taking care of sick people, we have children, we might be in that sandwich generation. There's so many things that pull, we may not be healthy, right? So when we're working with um, and we call them corporate athletes, our leaders, our executives, we are first looking at how are they taking care of themselves? And we do a self-management model in any of our executive tracks or coaching, which is about how are you sleeping? How are you, what are you putting in your mouth? Well, how are you moving? How are you engaging your brain? So, what how do you disconnect from work and explore so that you're you stay relevant and you are recharging? Are you actually going out on vacation and disconnecting all of these good habits that you need so that you can perform optimally? So we start with each individual first, and that looks very different for different executives, right? Like the it's never even say, for example, if we're talking about time management, somebody might have problems setting goals, but another person might have trouble saying no, right? So even though the symptoms to an employee can look the same about the leader, we need to really dig down into that individual level to figure out how they can perform optimally and take good care of them. And a lot of it is having the courage to say no, right? So we tend to want to take on the world. So teaching uh executive strong delegation skills, having them do the courage to say no. What should I? I always say goals are so great because they tell us what to do, but more importantly, tell us what not to do, right? Which is really critical. So we're teaching all these skills to help someone to reduce that overburden stress. Do you not trust your team because you are controlling, right? And only you can do it the right way. Or do you not trust your team because you know the right people on the team and you haven't addressed problems, right? So again, there's so many ways to try to really get to that individual why to help change that. But when we see burnout, um, there's so many different reasons for it. And a lot of times it is about either getting the person to admit it and have the self-awareness so that they can get the help they need. Sometimes the help isn't at work, sometimes they need to go see a doctor, sometimes they need to see a therapist, sometimes they just need to put on the calendar that they're gonna do something for themselves, and it's okay.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

It's okay, it's okay. I I love this conversation because it just resonates so much uh with what we do and why we build the platform, because that awareness, being able to look, and clients always say, Joyce, being able to go through and look at all those areas of my life. I thought I was doing well, but I hadn't really I hadn't broken down the links and see how they're interconnected and what I'm doing because we could be doing all the great things and that we know, but none of the great things that we don't we're not aware of. And that we say is what we don't know and sometimes control us. So it's getting them that opportunity to start seeing from a broader perspective where those issues are and getting at them before they become costly, before they because when the leader breaks down, then the team suffer the consequences. And you know, in my work over the last 30 years, you can imagine going into some situation, and the problem is the leader. The leader is a lot of the times the problem, and so a lot of the work has to go back to that leader to help them to realign themselves in these nine areas, and each area breaks broken down into like 20 variables to look at where are you off the wagon and how do we get you back on so that you're able to perform at that high level. One of the things that we talk a little uh a lot about and we hear is accountability and control. And you mentioned that a little bit when you say um being able to get people to be responsible and to do the things they need to do. I know coming from sports, you have to be very accountable and have high self accountability. How do you carry that forward into your work? And I love this whole idea of corporate athletes, actually. It's uh A really great uh way to see them.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

Yeah, we always say at Compass that uh you're a corporate athlete, except unlike professional athletes, you don't get an off season, right? So it makes even harder. And also, you know, it's 24-7. And that what differentiates, I think, a lot of athletics versus being in corporate America is being uh without wins, right? So I'm always trying to get leaders to celebrate wins, break up the year, because if you are always practicing, which is going to work every day and not getting feedback, it is exhausting. And so at least they get games to see how they're doing, how they're performing. So we have to create those environments as well in the workplace.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

So important. So important. This is this is such a powerful conversation. And if if someone wants to connect with you, Lisa, what is where do they reach you? What are you doing? Sure.

SPEAKER_00 22:56

Oh, thank you. Um, well, they can reach um out to if you go to our website, wearecompass.com. I'm alisa at wearecompass.com, just like we are Penn State, which my my youngest attends, um, W-E-A-R-E-C-O-M-P-A-S-S.com, and you can see all the things that we do for our clients. But we talked about um, you know, sometimes it's really hard to make mistakes. We work with Department of Defense clients, for example. And so in what they do, they can't make a mistake, right? You can't put a nuclear component on a submarine and make a mistake. And so it is hard then to say, I'm gonna keep my people accountable, and uh, but not 100% be in control. So that trust issue is really difficult. And I think trying to help leaders to know when they have the judgment of when do you need to make sure that you are accountable? Because as we say to our leaders, and we're working with an executive team at an off-site shortly here, and there's a slide on this whole thing about when you are an executive team or a leader, um, all the good things, the applause goes to your team, right? But when things don't go well, that is when we, as the executives, and especially the CEO of an organization, has to say, what did I do incorrectly? What it all rolls back to us, the highest level. We always say the fish rots from the head down. And so that CEO is ultimately responsible. We're working with a really fabulous president of a university, and he was also concerned, and we know academia has been no picnic over the last couple of years for many, many reasons that we won't get into on this podcast. Um, but you know, of course, there could be a lot of burnout in that environment. And so one of the set workshops we did was the CEO working with the rest of the cabinet to determine what are the acceptable behaviors and unacceptable behaviors? What happens when we go on pay time off? Can we really leave? Do we need to be checking? What really happens if I want to take a walk during the day or roll out my yoga mat? Is that acceptable? Is that not acceptable? We really work with our team at Compass to make sure that we have all these appropriate norms so that we can build the culture and the resiliency that we want. One of the things that we've done, Joyce, and I think we've been talking a little bit about this in snippets here, is protecting our team from isolation, which creates intense burnout. And so we have goals at Compass. First of all, we have unlimited paid time off, but you have to take a certain amount of paid time off during the year at intervals because we want you to go away. We are a competent team, we've got your back, you go recharge. That's really critical for us because a lot of times with an unlimited PTO, people actually the research say, take less time away. So we want to say, no, no, we trust you as adults, you're professionals, but make sure that you are taking care of yourself. The other goal that we set up, because we have a lot of consultants around the country, and we don't get to work, uh, we do a lot of this Zoom, Teams, right, during the day, and we're not always on site with a client in person. And so we have requirements of how many times they have to be sort of back at the mothership with Compass, working with their teammates and their clients to make sure we have that interaction with humans and it's not just a screen. So I'm always really concerned about isolation when it comes to burnout. And you know, Gallup has a great question on their engagement survey. Who's your best friend at work? People don't like that question. It's really a quirlical question. It means who's that person you can love and trust on your team when things go wrong or you want to celebrate? And so, how do we build that into organizations? All these things to try to help people perform their best.

SPEAKER_01 27:10

You know, this is really a great conversation because as you speak of that, I remember 20 years ago when I was, I believe, gifted with the wellness improvements and the nine dimensions. And the first one is the spiritual, then the social, the emotional. Then we look at the occupational, intellectual, environmental, we look at financial, physical, and then the interpersonal. And when I started, I was so terrified to talk about the spirit at work and talk about the spiritual. Would you believe that that's where we do a lot of the work? Because people's lives are so complex in today's day and age. And the realities that our parents had 50, 100 years ago is very different from what we're facing, and our children and our workplaces and our clients are facing now. And it is so important to have these types of conversations. And as as I'm going through the critique of this book on the resilience anchors, which is based in that dimension, it's it's the self-esteem, it's the passion, it's the whole element of who we are, it's the faith, the hope, the belief, the things that keep us, that anchor us when things around us go off. And it's so important for us to build those elements because as you were saying earlier, the whole world has changed. And the stresses of family, family support, children, so many things. And even just the things as we watch or hear, the conflicts that are happening in the world that affects everything else. It's so important in a time like now to have this conversation. So I just wanted to ask you this question as we wrap up. When you think about leaders and organizations that you serve right now, why is it so important to have this conversation right now? What are you seeing as you've transitioned over the changes? Because I know I'm thinking 30 years ago when we started, conversations at work were very different than they are now. Why do you think it's so timely to have these conversations right now?

SPEAKER_00 29:22

Um, regarding the spiritual component, first of all, I am very strong in my Jewish faith. And that grounds me, that is my compass when we talk about compass, right? There's so many great teachings, teachings that I that are personal to me. When it comes to our clients, we meet them where they are. And so some of our clients, they're faith-based nonprofit organizations, and that's really critical. There's other clients that that is something that we don't address, and that's okay too. But I do remember working, uh coaching and executive, and I was having a really difficult time pressing the right buttons with this one individual, and I could not get her to change her leadership thought process. And I found a great book. She was very strong in her Christian faith, and I found a great leadership book that was based on that. That pushed that button for that individual. So when we talk about, and you know, we call it the wheel. Um, I love how you say anchors, whether it's financial, educational, spiritual, family, that pie looks different for everybody, right? So for some people, spiritual is an enormous pie that you that speaks to them. And we we do that all the time when we do the artifact exercise with our teams where they go around and tell what's really important. We just did it with this one organization. One person talked about this piece of the Berlin Wall in their German history, and another person talked about uh a uh Christian Bible that went with them all the way on every um deployment they had when they were in the military. So we we are we open to what is it that makes you as a human, but it's not spiritual for everybody, or the same amount of spirituality. And I think that's really important when we customize our work to really help people. For some people, I say, for example, they need to see a therapist and talk it through. For other people, they need to work out and do yoga, or they need to be in nature, right? Like I think it's so interesting with optimal performance. It's about what works for that individual. Joyce, and you you will never find the same person as you, right? And so, what is it that makes that person unique, and how do we unlock that performance using what is important to them, their priorities in that different stages of life, right? So that changes as we go through life's challenges as well, right?

SPEAKER_01 31:56

So very true, and and we come at spiritual from breath, that person. Um and spiritual is very different from religion. Religion is one element and so important because many people are terrified to look at that part of themselves, thinking that I have to be religious. We want to freedom from that and say, no, it's not. You you will put on this earth and you have a purpose, you got it's it's connected to your spirit, and you need to be able to find that and remove the barrier and the roadblock and the assumptions that you're holding that tells you that this is a place you don't want to go because uh why limit yourself? And many leaders are finding freedom in recognizing that hey, I can be, I can look at that spiritual element of myself without it being tied to any other connotation besides me, where I'm at right now in my journey, my who am I and my why am I is tied into that same dimension. So it's just fabulous. And I love that we we've gotten to have this conversation today, Alisa. Uh, what is one thing someone is listening to us that you want to say to a one of our listeners today?

SPEAKER_00 33:17

Oh, thank you. Well, I want to like sort of pull what you just said because I find it so interesting, and that is about purpose, right? We work with a lot of organizations to figure out what is the purpose. And in some organizations, it's so mission-based, it's so easy to say what the purpose is. And that's really important for recruiting corporate athletes, right? You better figure out what that purpose is, but we also work on leadership brands. So the corporation will hopefully have a strong purpose, and you have to find that. And then what's your leadership brand? What is the purpose that you want to bring to work every day? How do you want to be known? And we walk people through an exercise to do that. So exactly that every day they can also make decisions based on who they are, they their why, and stay true and trusted. So bringing all these pieces that we had the joy of talking about today, all these are interwoven. It's not right, it's not like individual things, they all come together. And I love that you talk about purpose on a global level within your organization, and then finding that leadership purpose and why for yourself too. And that goes for leaders again, doesn't mean that you have the title of manager, director, executive, VP, right? We are all leaders. And so, how do we all want to show up in every aspect of our life? Because there's not just a work you and a home you. We're just one messy, imperfect, perfect person, and to have that grace for for ourselves and for others.

SPEAKER_01 34:52

Absolutely. And it's uh it's the system, everything is interconnected, yes, and it's that domino effect. If we're not doing well spiritually, we're going to have challenges socially, we're going to have challenges emotionally, and that's gonna affect our work, you know, occupation intellectually. It's just we've seen that cycle over and over again. And I do a lot of work with uh government organizations here in Canada, and we see the importance of when things change in the workplace, how you need to adapt and be agile mentally, emotionally. But if you're not working on that, who and that why that becomes even more difficult. So it's it's been a fabulous conversation. I love talking with you. And uh, for those of you who are listening today, uh, thank you for tuning in to the Resilience Catalyst show. What we do here is make resilience attainable, we make it simple. It's not uh a word out there that doesn't mean anything, it's a currency that you use in your life and in your work, and we do everything to make you have the ability to build your resilience in your mindset to deal to be able to thrive in today's economy, in today's society. And certainly uh we welcome, and it was such a fabulous conversation with Elisa out there, and we look forward to further communication and sharing more with you. So stay tuned for next podcast. Elisa, it was lovely having you on today.

SPEAKER_00 36:32

Oh, it was an honor. Thank you for having me so much. It was a great conversation, Joyce.

unknown 36:37

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 36:38

As you go back into your work and life, remember that success and sustainable performance don't come from pushing harder, it comes from building capacity. Your resilience can be rebuilt, strengthened, and sustained, but it takes one intentional step at a time. Thank you for spending this time with me on the Resilience Catholic Show. I'm Joyce Fedicon, your host, your friend. Until next time, take care of your energy and your resilience.